Vets Bets: UFC 68 - Page 2

Kid A · 03-04-2007, 10:13 AM

Finish him with what? He's a slower fighter than CC, who's going to soften him up for a round or two while Randy tries to get on the inside and start unloading on him when he's hurt towards 3-4. Fedor put Mirko on the ground several times and still had very little success at hurting him. Do you believe that Randy has better g'n'p or submissions than Fedor? Or that he's a quicker and more explosive HW?

It was great to see someone handle Sylvia and I give Couture credit for fighting a smart and technically well-executed fight, but he showed nothing that convinces me he'll handle Mirko any better than he performed the last two occasions against Liddell. At this point of his career he's probably better at dealing with size than speed.

JohnGalt · 03-04-2007, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kid A

Finish him with what? He's a slower fighter than CC, who's going to soften him up for a round or two while Randy tries to get on the inside and start unloading on him when he's hurt towards 3-4. Fedor put Mirko on the ground several times and still had very little success at hurting him. Do you believe that Randy has better g'n'p or submissions than Fedor? Or that he's a quicker and more explosive HW?

It was great to see someone handle Sylvia and I give Couture credit for fighting a smart and technically well-executed fight, but he showed nothing that convinces me he'll handle Mirko any better than he performed the last two occasions against Liddell. At this point of his career he's probably better at dealing with size than speed.

I definately think Randy has better GnP than Fedor, especially in the UFC. He'll be able to stack CC up against the cage and rain death down on him. But, the biggest factor in my prediction is the fact that CC is a smallish HW and Randy is one of the PfP strongest fighters and has the best MMA wrestling that I have ever seen. Fedor is a great fighter, but he can't sniff Randy's jock when it comes to wrestling. And, don't throw Coleman in there as an example of what CC can do against wrestlers. Coleman has been a shot fighter for years and still insists on shooting doubles from a mile away. This is coupled with the fact that CC has a great SPRAWL, which won't help him at all against Randy. Chuck was able to fend Randy off because Chuck is actually a very good wrestler himself, CC cannot claim that. Randy does what Fedor does with upper body takedowns, but Randy actually has a great pedigree in it. I don't think Fedor is any stronger than Randy, and I'm beginning to question whether he's any more explosive. I don't think Randy should be favored, but I'm predicting an upset.

MR. NASTY · 03-04-2007, 11:43 AM

If anything....last nights fight just confirmed my belief that Chuck could handle Feodr with ease..... Randy does everything Fedor does as a heavy....but better.... but look what happened to him last time he crossed swords with Chuck...

JohnGalt · 03-04-2007, 11:49 AM

When CC gasses against Randy...God help him.

Kid A · 03-04-2007, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MR. NASTY

If anything....last nights fight just confirmed my belief that Chuck could handle Feodr with ease..... Randy does everything Fedor does as a heavy....but better.... but look what happened to him last time he crossed swords with Chuck...

USA....USA....USA....

JohnGalt · 03-04-2007, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kid A

USA....USA....USA....

Jealous.

MR. NASTY · 03-04-2007, 12:19 PM

I want Randy to win too John. Hopefully it's competitive, but there's no way Randy's gonna be able to hang on the outside and set up his takedowns with Crocop. He will get punished. Your analysis also assumes that Randy will be able to close the gap and force the clinch easily, Crocops reflexes and movement will make that very fucking hard. The bit about Crocop's upper body takedown defence being shoddy is tosh too, if Chuck can keep Randy off then so can he. Sure he hasn't been tested in that department against Randy yet but he's looked incredible against some very big decent guys. And anyway Chuck isn't an amazing wrestler, he's just great at certain things.

Kid A · 03-04-2007, 12:39 PM

What Nasty said. Assuming they weren't trolling Galt and R.S's hope of saving face is sucking mad couture cock. Wonder what they'll cling to when CC puts Randy in a coma.

Liddell will knock him out... his punching is too unorthodox for Mirko to handle... Mirko has a suspect chin... he's prone to gassing, just watch the kanehara fight... Liddell's wrestling is superior, he could take him down at will...

DerBeppo · 03-04-2007, 12:58 PM

so, the question is, does this solidify chuck as #1 lhw over shogun seeing as he has two wins over the current ufc hw champ?

gym dumb · 03-04-2007, 01:01 PM

I think I'll wait for insidefighting to release updated rankings before we can truly know the impact last night had on any rankings.

Fredricks · 03-04-2007, 02:38 PM

I would still like to see Randy finish a guy, and not because he is crazy cardio man who wears people out, but because he actually caught someone

Von Smooten · 03-04-2007, 03:03 PM

Christ, between Pride 33 and now this, the rankings are going to be bizarre to say the least.

Blue, get on that.

asdf · 03-04-2007, 04:24 PM

Couture returned specifically at this point because he saw gaping holes in Sylvia's game that he could exploit with his superior technique and intelligence. Unfortunately, Crocop isn't a retard who only knows how to throw lazy, sluggish jabs. Couture still has excellent reflexes for an old man, but I seriously doubt they're good enough to get past Mirko's strikes.

asdf · 03-04-2007, 04:37 PM

Randy has too many bad losses to be considered the best ever. Losing by submission to the elder Overeem, a leglock specialist who was heelhooked by Igor fucking Vovchanchyn, is impossible to really excuse. Sure he's incredible when he's on, but his flaws have to be considered too before claiming him to be the greatest of all time.

Von Smooten · 03-04-2007, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asdf

Couture returned specifically at this point because he saw gaping holes in Sylvia's game that he could exploit with his superior technique and intelligence.

He's also said that he made the final decision to come back once he realized he'd have the opportunity to fight Crocop.

asdf · 03-04-2007, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Smooten

He's also said that he made the final decision to come back once he realized he'd have the opportunity to fight Crocop.

Hmm, missed that part. He could be just talking shit, but maybe he really sees something? I still think he's way in over his head on that one.

el dante · 03-04-2007, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fredricks

I would still like to see Randy finish a guy, and not because he is crazy cardio man who wears people out, but because he actually caught someone

he beat the snot out of chuck the first time they fought, probably because chuck actively tried to improve his position rathter than just covering his ears and meditating "this too shall pass" or something to that effect (a?).

JohnGalt · 03-04-2007, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asdf

Randy has too many bad losses to be considered the best ever. Losing by submission to the elder Overeem, a leglock specialist who was heelhooked by Igor fucking Vovchanchyn, is impossible to really excuse. Sure he's incredible when he's on, but his flaws have to be considered too before claiming him to be the greatest of all time.

In RINGS where GnP is banned. I'm trying to figure out how Randy actually won in RINGS.

Azmodan · 03-05-2007, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asdf

Randy has too many bad losses to be considered the best ever. Losing by submission to the elder Overeem, a leglock specialist who was heelhooked by Igor fucking Vovchanchyn, is impossible to really excuse. Sure he's incredible when he's on, but his flaws have to be considered too before claiming him to be the greatest of all time.

Quote:

In RINGS where GnP is banned. I'm trying to figure out how Randy actually won in RINGS.

Although Galt has a point, asdf is largely right. Too many losses to people he shouldn't lose to. While he's been the champ in two weight divisions, he's also been run out of two weight divisions. :/

asdf · 03-05-2007, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

In RINGS where GnP is banned. I'm trying to figure out how Randy actually won in RINGS.

I don't care if Rings didn't allow Couture to breathe. You can't be the greatest ever when you have a loss to Valentijn Overeem.

Randy Savage · 03-05-2007, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azmodan

Although Galt has a point, asdf is largely right. Too many losses to people he shouldn't lose to. While he's been the champ in two weight divisions, he's also been run out of two weight divisions. :/

meh

03-04-2007, 10:13 AM	#51
Kid A Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,373 Diggs: 7 vCash: 250	Finish him with what? He's a slower fighter than CC, who's going to soften him up for a round or two while Randy tries to get on the inside and start unloading on him when he's hurt towards 3-4. Fedor put Mirko on the ground several times and still had very little success at hurting him. Do you believe that Randy has better g'n'p or submissions than Fedor? Or that he's a quicker and more explosive HW? It was great to see someone handle Sylvia and I give Couture credit for fighting a smart and technically well-executed fight, but he showed nothing that convinces me he'll handle Mirko any better than he performed the last two occasions against Liddell. At this point of his career he's probably better at dealing with size than speed. __________________ It was all whirlwind, heat and flash. Within a week we killed my parents and hit the road. Don't be fooled by the rocks that I got, I'm still Jin'emon from the block. Last edited by Kid A : 03-04-2007 at 10:27 AM.

03-04-2007, 11:43 AM	#53
MR. NASTY Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: ENGLAND Posts: 19,332 Diggs: 0 vCash: 969	If anything....last nights fight just confirmed my belief that Chuck could handle Feodr with ease..... Randy does everything Fedor does as a heavy....but better.... but look what happened to him last time he crossed swords with Chuck... __________________ You're a proper chav Nasty and you're not full white either, you look like the kind of kids that terrorise poor estates. -Synesthesia. Last edited by MR. NASTY : 03-04-2007 at 11:56 AM.

03-04-2007, 11:49 AM	#54
JohnGalt Hype Destroyer Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,316 Diggs: 0 vCash: 571	When CC gasses against Randy...God help him. __________________ "Sometimes hype just ain't enough"

03-04-2007, 12:19 PM	#57
MR. NASTY Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: ENGLAND Posts: 19,332 Diggs: 0 vCash: 969	I want Randy to win too John. Hopefully it's competitive, but there's no way Randy's gonna be able to hang on the outside and set up his takedowns with Crocop. He will get punished. Your analysis also assumes that Randy will be able to close the gap and force the clinch easily, Crocops reflexes and movement will make that very fucking hard. The bit about Crocop's upper body takedown defence being shoddy is tosh too, if Chuck can keep Randy off then so can he. Sure he hasn't been tested in that department against Randy yet but he's looked incredible against some very big decent guys. And anyway Chuck isn't an amazing wrestler, he's just great at certain things. __________________ You're a proper chav Nasty and you're not full white either, you look like the kind of kids that terrorise poor estates. -Synesthesia.

03-04-2007, 12:39 PM	#58
Kid A Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,373 Diggs: 7 vCash: 250	What Nasty said. Assuming they weren't trolling Galt and R.S's hope of saving face is sucking mad couture cock. Wonder what they'll cling to when CC puts Randy in a coma. Liddell will knock him out... his punching is too unorthodox for Mirko to handle... Mirko has a suspect chin... he's prone to gassing, just watch the kanehara fight... Liddell's wrestling is superior, he could take him down at will... __________________ It was all whirlwind, heat and flash. Within a week we killed my parents and hit the road. Don't be fooled by the rocks that I got, I'm still Jin'emon from the block.

03-04-2007, 12:58 PM	#59
DerBeppo War Against My Liver Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 6,828 Diggs: 0 vCash: 425	so, the question is, does this solidify chuck as #1 lhw over shogun seeing as he has two wins over the current ufc hw champ?

03-04-2007, 01:01 PM	#60
gym dumb Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: .-_< Posts: 3,348 Diggs: 0 vCash: 250	I think I'll wait for insidefighting to release updated rankings before we can truly know the impact last night had on any rankings. __________________ "You can't have everything. Where would you put it?" ~ Steven Wright I do everything half assed but I work twice as long.

03-04-2007, 02:38 PM	#61
Fredricks Boner Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 6,729 Diggs: 0 vCash: 643	I would still like to see Randy finish a guy, and not because he is crazy cardio man who wears people out, but because he actually caught someone

03-04-2007, 03:03 PM	#62
Von Smooten Juggernaut of Chicanery Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: The moral high ground Posts: 15,637 Diggs: 64 vCash: 700	Christ, between Pride 33 and now this, the rankings are going to be bizarre to say the least. Blue, get on that. __________________ O fish, are you constant to the old covenant?

03-04-2007, 04:24 PM	#63
asdf Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 2,236 Diggs: 0 vCash: 250	Couture returned specifically at this point because he saw gaping holes in Sylvia's game that he could exploit with his superior technique and intelligence. Unfortunately, Crocop isn't a retard who only knows how to throw lazy, sluggish jabs. Couture still has excellent reflexes for an old man, but I seriously doubt they're good enough to get past Mirko's strikes.

03-04-2007, 04:37 PM	#64
asdf Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 2,236 Diggs: 0 vCash: 250	Randy has too many bad losses to be considered the best ever. Losing by submission to the elder Overeem, a leglock specialist who was heelhooked by Igor fucking Vovchanchyn, is impossible to really excuse. Sure he's incredible when he's on, but his flaws have to be considered too before claiming him to be the greatest of all time.